[Baggiebob(BBB)]

Big Al is no mug, nor is he a spring chicken, so he'll know he'll have a 10% chance of another Prem team - other than abroad, and he won't want that at his age. So my bet is if he get the backing he'll stay and get us back up again hopefully with new ownership.

[BaggieSteve]

As well as losing the loan players, the rest of the squad will have their wages slashed as a result of relegation. So those who we’d like to keep and who, in normal circumstances, would happily stay, may opt to go. I’m thinking of players like Ajayi, Bartley, Diangana etc, as well as the obvious ones such as Pereira and Johnstone. What we are left with may be the dross, to be honest. This may be a very pessimistic view but I fear a fire sale

[Salopbaggie]

Not so sure, of course any manager can only work with what they have, but Allardyce's record is no better (if even as good) as Bilic, even after SA's improvements. I would not be prepared to offer him a contract based on the Chelsea game alone, Bilic managed a 3-3 against them, Chelski had 11 men on the pitch in that game as well. Bilic also drew away against Man City with a worse squad, so lets not get to carried away because he won a game.. If SA was a contender he would have been in a job when we signed him up. we might not know why but you can bet every other Premiership and Championship clubs did not require his services for a reason.

[Slick_Footwork]

Not so sure, of course any manager can only work with what they have, but Allardyce's record is no better (if even as good) as Bilic, even after SA's improvements.  I would not be prepared to offer him a contract based on the Chelsea game alone, Bilic managed a 3-3 against them, Chelski had 11 men on the pitch in that game as well.  Bilic also drew away against Man City with a worse squad, so lets not get to carried away because he won a game..  If SA was a contender he would have been in a job when we signed him up. we might not know why but you can bet every other Premiership and Championship clubs did not require his services for a reason.

On paper, Allardyce has a 'slightly' better record than Bilic...

Bilic had 13 league games and we picked up 7 points, scoring 10 goals and conceding 26.

In Allardyce's first 13 league games we picked up 10 points, scoring 12 and conceding 27. This is not taking into account yesterday's results.

But the big difference for me is in the quality of signings, the number of bodies we get in the box, the fact teams no longer cut through us like a hot knife through butter...

We looked like a joke of a team under Bilic and now we actually look like a team fit to grace the league. Of course, that's largely down to the quality of the additions, but we wasted loads of cash in the summer spending £30m+ on 3 left wingers in Robbo, Grant and Grady. The records might be comparable, but the quality difference in player recognition is chalk and cheese.

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As well as losing the loan players, the rest of the squad will have their wages slashed as a result of relegation. So those who we’d like to keep and who, in normal circumstances, would happily stay, may opt to go. I’m thinking of players like Ajayi, Bartley, Diangana etc, as well as the obvious ones such as Pereira and Johnstone. What we are left with may be the dross, to be honest. This may be a very pessimistic view but I fear a fire sale

This is the fear I have too.

Although, with the current financial impact of covid, I'm not sure anyone will want any of our players with the exception of Johnstone and Pereira. I don't think the likes of Ajayi or Grady have done enough, especially when you consider how much we paid for Grady. So really depends how hard up we are, if we have to let them go on the cheap.

If Johnstone and Pereira go and the cash is reinvested, we should be in a good position to mount a challenge...

But i've always felt that after Hegazi was sold mid window, we might actually be in the sh*te financially and this could lead to others being sold on the cheap...

[BaggieSteve]

You’re right, Slick, that few players have enhanced their value with the exception of some of the loan players, Johnstone and, in recent games, Pereira. However, you mention Ajayi and Diangana, and I think teams might take a punt on their potential if they can get them cheaply. My concern is that, assuming we get good money for Johnstone and Pereira, it is invested to bring in a playmaker to rival Pereira, similarly to Brentford when they used the Watkins money to sign Toney. Pereira was the stand out performer for us last season; I don’t think we can afford to use his transfer money to bring in the equivalent of 4 Snodgrasses.

[Salopbaggie]

Not so sure, of course any manager can only work with what they have, but Allardyce's record is no better (if even as good) as Bilic, even after SA's improvements.  I would not be prepared to offer him a contract based on the Chelsea game alone, Bilic managed a 3-3 against them, Chelski had 11 men on the pitch in that game as well.  Bilic also drew away against Man City with a worse squad, so lets not get to carried away because he won a game..  If SA was a contender he would have been in a job when we signed him up. we might not know why but you can bet every other Premiership and Championship clubs did not require his services for a reason.

On paper, Allardyce has a 'slightly' better record than Bilic...

Bilic had 13 league games and we picked up 7 points,  scoring 10 goals and conceding 26.

In Allardyce's first 13 league games we picked up 10 points, scoring 12 and conceding 27. This is not taking into account yesterday's results.

But the big difference for me is in the quality of signings, the number of bodies we get in the box, the fact teams no longer cut through us like a hot knife through butter...

We looked like a joke of a team under Bilic and now we actually look like a team fit to grace the league. Of course, that's largely down to the quality of the additions, but we wasted loads of cash in the summer spending £30m+ on 3 left wingers in Robbo, Grant and Grady. The records might be comparable, but the quality difference in player recognition is chalk and cheese.

---

As well as losing the loan players, the rest of the squad will have their wages slashed as a result of relegation. So those who we’d like to keep and who, in normal circumstances, would happily stay, may opt to go. I’m thinking of players like Ajayi, Bartley, Diangana etc, as well as the obvious ones such as Pereira and Johnstone. What we are left with may be the dross, to be honest. This may be a very pessimistic view but I fear a fire sale

This is the fear I have too.

Although, with the current financial impact of covid, I'm not sure anyone will want any of our players with the exception of Johnstone and Pereira. I don't think the likes of Ajayi or Grady have done enough, especially when you consider how much we paid for Grady. So really depends how hard up we are, if we have to let them go on the cheap.

If Johnstone and Pereira go and the cash is reinvested, we should be in a good position to mount a challenge...

But i've always felt that after Hegazi was sold mid window, we might actually be in the sh*te financially and this could lead to others being sold on the cheap...

That is one way of looking at the figures Slick, Another would be during both managers first 15 games (Allardyce's first 15 games) this season and all 15 of Bilic's.

Bilic won 2 games to Allardyce's 1 WBA scored 15 goals under Bilic against 12 for Allardyce and conceded 28 under Bilic against 33 under Allardyce.

No doubt the signings were an improvement and all I am saying is Allardyce isn't all he is being made out as

[WBA-Josh]

We were a joke under Allardyce until the new signings were in and able to play. The first match that all of the new signings were available was the Spurs game. Before that it was 5 points from 9 matches including hammerings by Villa, Leeds, Arsenal and Man City. Also a cup defeat to Blackpool.

Since the new signings were included it has been 9 points from 8 matches and 3 clean sheets. Goal return is still low with 7 in 8 matches but defensively it is 7 goals shipped in 8 which is solid for a team in our position.

That highlights the impact that the new signings have had, how poor the team was before the 4 new players, how piss-poor Allardyce's work was with the squad that he inherited and how he has finally been able to turn us into a ok team that still has a chance of staying up.

[Salopbaggie]

It wasn't that the players we had were all bad, in fact I don't remember to many on this board objecting very hard towards any of the signings, the problem was and still is to an extent with the balance of the team. I think most people on here during the summer window, had identified we were desperate for a Yacob style defensive midfielder. The club brings in Okay and the team starts to gain momentum, thing is if we could all see it, you would assume that those at the club who make their living from the professional game would have seen it as well, but as usual the board thought they would risk it, try and stay up with out spending any money. So I think my point is if we could all see it 4 months ago, the club final gets round to biting the bullet, doesn't make Allardyce, the almighty saviour. If he keeps us up then fair enough, ill have to eat my words and will happily do so with a big slice of humble pie and I will love every mouthful.

Mind you I am not to troubled either way, I like football where going shoulder to shoulder is not a sending off offence and the breeze of a player running past is not enough to knock an opposing player over or if you clip a player ankle
they go down like they have been shot holding their face.. I also like not knowing which 6 of the teams will be in the top half of the league at the end of the season, before it even starts.

[Blue Baggie]

Like him or loathe big Sam, he has come in and spent little or no money and improved the team. Our organisation and fitness has improved. With a summer window we should expect further improvements. And all with minimal amounts of transfer money. He really has to stay.
As for another manager, they would come in and shuffle the pack and change our pattern of play. Wilder and the other ex baggies players have nothing more to offer then big Sam. Big Sam has 6 months head start so I would keep him until we are promoted.

[drewks]

Like him or loathe big Sam, he has come in and spent little or no money and improved the team. Our organisation and fitness has improved. With a summer window we should expect further improvements. And all with minimal amounts of transfer money. He really has to stay.
As for another manager, they would come in and shuffle the pack and change our pattern of play. Wilder and the other ex baggies players have nothing more to offer then big Sam. Big Sam has 6 months head start so I would keep him until we are promoted.

Nice logic there, BB.
I agree.