[St Charles Owl]

Well two great goals to compensate for the previous two that the referee "scored". Those last two deserve to win a World Cup. I think we're seeing a team, in France, who have players light years ahead of England's

Disagree with that, they are better than England at this moment for sure, but I don’t think England are light years behind them!!  We are a couple of years behind their youth coming through, but if our youngsters keep developing then we will add more quality to our team and we won’t be far off them.

France are going to rule a generation of football much as the Spanish did.

I am not convinced that any team is going to rule football in the next few tournaments. Current U20 world champions are England, Italy and Uruguay were 3rd and 4th, there are a number of teams with very good youngsters coming through, its going to be an interesting few years as for me there is no stand out team like we have seen in the past.

[Slick_Footwork]

Correct.

The simple fact is though, that in the Premier League, the best player in every position comes from outwith England. Thats something to bear in mind.

I dont rate southgate,i don't believe he is the kind of coach that can go toe to toe and beat the top european sides coaches. Nor do i think england have the kind of talent and technically strong players that the top nations have.

The media and pundits have gone totally overboard (no surprise there!) Germany, Spain, Italy, Holland et al will never be that pish again or fail to qualify. They have tremendous young talent coming through,technically superior to what england have.

I think england did ok,nothing more with the draw they had. Maguire has had a good tournament and you worked your set plays effectively enough. But you didn't beat anyone of note, if it had been france v england today it would have been a similar score.... imagine young up against mbappe ffs

Accurate point about the best players in the Premier League being foreign. De Bruyne, Hazard, Salah, Kante, Mahrez are all foreign and been stand outs in recent years.

When you talk about English players at the absolute top in their position, there's only really Harry Kane who can hold his own.

That said, international football is a collective where you can't just put all the best individuals together like club football. That's why some of the sides with the best individual players aren't good. Salah was one of the best players at the World Cup but Egypt were dreadful, because their XI was piss poor. Mahrez didn't even make it to the competition...

It's a tough job for whoever is in charge of England because of mass imports restricting the path for British players. Especially frustrating because of the plethora of average joes in the league who are foreign. There's definitely not much quality to pick from for England.

Despite that, given our route which was very fortunate, I firmly believe a good tactical manager could've won this tournament for us. Not because we had the best individual players, but because we had weapons to hurt the opposition. As you say, we only really looked threatening from set plays, which begs the question why Southgate didn't opt for Gary Cahill instead of Kyle Walker at centre half. He would've been better in both boxes and you need a bit of experience, Cahill is a Champions League winner. You also have to question why Southgate would opt to play possession football, rather than counter attacking, with the fastest England team in memory.

Also think Southgate missed a trick not taking Shelvey. Yes, he's a bit of a nutcase and doesn't play for a top team, but is right at the top of the list when it comes to central midfielders who can play a penetrative pass. We bemoan lack of creativity, but any pundit worth his salt was calling for Shelvey pre tournament.

But overall, you're right, we don't have the best to choose from right now...

But what I'd question is your statement about Holland, Germany, Italy and Spain having so many more technically gifted young players coming through than England. Is there any substance to this or are you just plucking the statement from thin air?

Rashford, 20. Joe Gomez, 21. Alexander Arnold, 19. Already look like very good players.

Dele Alli only recently turned 22, despite the fact it seems like he's been around forever. Probably as good as anyone in the world in his position, at his age. Who else has scored as many goals from midfield in a top league?

Ryan Sessengnon looks a hell of a prospect with 20 league goals to his name already, just turned 18. Played a hell of a pass for Fulham's goal in the playoff final. Might already be ready for England, considering we lacked that final ball.

Mason Mount got into double figures for Vitesse last year from midfield. Kid can play a pass too.

Jadon Sancho is only 18 and already playing for Dortmund's first team.

Phil Foden and Callum Hudson-Odoi made league appearances for Man City and Chelsea respectively last year and both looked like exceptional talents at 17.

I could go on... IMO, it feels like we have the best crop of young players coming through that I can remember. Whether of not they get a fair crack of the whip at Premier League level remains to be seen, but certainly it seems brighter than the last 20 years.

[BaggieSteve]

I honestly think that, with this squad of players, England have done the best they could. The only two teams we comprehensively beat were an abject Panama and a dour, uninspiring Sweden. When we came up against teams that had that spark of flair and creativity, most notably Belgium and Croatia, we were greatly lacking. We have no players that are even close to De Bruyne, Hazard, Modric and Racitic. I appreciate these are exceptional footballers but Colombia and, at times, Tunisia exceeded us in their technical skill. We have midfielders who, in the words of our much lamented previous coach, work aard and will play within a structure but don't have that spark that will change a game out of nothing. Let's be honest, in watching our games in this tournament, most is got our hopes up when we got a corner or free kick as the likeliest source of a goal.

This is not a criticism of Southgate, I think he did a very good job with what he had; it's just that what he had wasn't good enough. By and large, PL midfields tend to be stocked by creative foreign players supported by hard working English/British yeomen. Can't help thinking that, as long as that continues, England will be destined to be continued plucky losers

Correct.

The simple fact is though, that in the Premier League, the best player in every position comes from outwith England. Thats something to bear in mind.

I dont rate southgate,i don't believe he is the kind of coach that can go toe to toe and beat the top european sides coaches. Nor do i think england have the kind of talent and technically strong players that the top nations have.

The media and pundits have gone totally overboard (no surprise there!)  Germany, Spain, Italy, Holland et al will never be that pish again or fail to qualify. They have tremendous young talent coming through,technically superior to what england have.

I think england did ok,nothing more with the draw they had. Maguire has had a good tournament and you worked your set plays effectively enough. But you didn't beat anyone of note, if it had been france v england today it would have been a similar score.... imagine young up against mbappe ffs  

I'd rather not imagine Ashley Young up against Mbappe, if that's OK with you

[Dingle-Dingle]

What ever happened to that bright young scoring machine Berahino?? Has he retired?? DD

[BaggieSteve]

I honestly think that, with this squad of players, England have done the best they could. The only two teams we comprehensively beat were an abject Panama and a dour, uninspiring Sweden. When we came up against teams that had that spark of flair and creativity, most notably Belgium and Croatia, we were greatly lacking. We have no players that are even close to De Bruyne, Hazard, Modric and Racitic. I appreciate these are exceptional footballers but Colombia and, at times, Tunisia exceeded us in their technical skill. We have midfielders who, in the words of our much lamented previous coach, work aard and will play within a structure but don't have that spark that will change a game out of nothing. Let's be honest, in watching our games in this tournament, most is got our hopes up when we got a corner or free kick as the likeliest source of a goal.

This is not a criticism of Southgate, I think he did a very good job with what he had; it's just that what he had wasn't good enough. By and large, PL midfields tend to be stocked by creative foreign players supported by hard working English/British yeomen. Can't help thinking that, as long as that continues, England will be destined to be continued plucky losers

Correct.

The simple fact is though, that in the Premier League, the best player in every position comes from outwith England. Thats something to bear in mind.

I dont rate southgate,i don't believe he is the kind of coach that can go toe to toe and beat the top european sides coaches. Nor do i think england have the kind of talent and technically strong players that the top nations have.

The media and pundits have gone totally overboard (no surprise there!)  Germany, Spain, Italy, Holland et al will never be that pish again or fail to qualify. They have tremendous young talent coming through,technically superior to what england have.

I think england did ok,nothing more with the draw they had. Maguire has had a good tournament and you worked your set plays effectively enough. But you didn't beat anyone of note, if it had been france v england today it would have been a similar score.... imagine young up against mbappe ffs  

I'd rather not imagine Ashley Young up against Mbappe, if that's OK with you

[Dingle-Dingle]

   

DD