[Arcane Astral Aeons]

as your probably aware
FIFA have told that the wearing of poppies in the upcoming England/Scotland is breaking their laws on the promoting of religious symbols.
since when?
FIFA(federation including f***ing assholes) aint got a clue
so it appears both sides will go ahead and risk the wrath of said organisation
and both wear black armband with a poppy on them at the risk of facing sanctions and possible points deduction

fair play to both the scottish and english football associations for standing together on this
as they say you shouldn`t mix politics and sport but this isnt either

every one on here will be marking armistice day in their own way wearing a poppy or not
even football players want to...and should be allowed to pay tribute to those who gave their lives in whatever war.
FIFA should realize its not political.

assholes

rant over

[Salopbaggie]

Been a while since we have had a good debate on a football related, but not Albion related topic and this looks like a contender.

While I totally see the case for these armbands, I also see F.I.F.A.'s position as well. The rules on wearing anything which makes a statement, political, religious "or a personal statements" are pretty clear. Where the problem lies is that if you do not totally apply the rule to everybody, in every circumstance, the rule ceases to be a rule and becomes more of a guidance. Also this type of issue is personally subjective and particularly comes to the front in international games.

I suspect the F.I.F.A. position is, if we just ban everything then we do not have to get into the position of having to judge what is acceptable and what is not. The problem for F.I.F.A. is each time you have to make a decision on an issue like this is someone will be upset, unfortunately on this occasion most people in the UK will be upset.

Do I agree with the Scottish and English F.A. decision to wear the armbands anyway, absolutely not, because if they are allowed to get away with it, who is going to break the rules next and hold this up as a precedent? Also is there really any need for them? If the rules say players can not wear them, then so be it. The poppy is supposed to be a symbol of remembrance, surely having the Royal Marine Band playing a few numbers before the game or something similar would act as a more fitting tribute, bearing in mind it is supposed to be about remembrance. Ask yourself what would you remember more, a group of players wearing armbands or a tribute by a military band before the game, of course that would mean people leaving the bar and the concession stores 10 minutes earlier and all that lost profit.

[St Charles Owl]

Surely the precedent has already been set when Ireland had a 100 year memorial for the Easter Monday uprising on their shirts earlier this year???

[Forever Young]

Good debate, whilst I agree with the sentiment of wearing an armband to remember and respect the dead, I also find the respective FA'S approach to " we'll wear them anyway and wait for the outcome!" extremely petulant and childish. If the rules state you cant wear anything other than the blindingly obvious, don't wear it!! This is exactly what is wrong with football right now, the authorities and the game in general just railroad all before them and do as they f****** well please and try to hide beyond the moral issue of wearing poppies in the first place.

I agree with Salop Baggie, a military band, a few words fro the British Legion, a poppy on the scoreboard and may'be a temporary structure with wreaths is more fitting and nullifies FIFO ( Fit in or f*** off ) basically, sorry FIFA's rules and sanctions. I just feel the FA's are being extremely arrogant and trying to flex their muscles, if this goes ahead, what next?

If I have upset anybody with my frankly forthright views, I apologise, it's just football getting to big for its boots and acting like a kid in the playground who wont play ball. This is a very emotive subject and as like many of you, I have past family members in wars gone by who have sadly fallen, I wear my poppy with pride and give generously to this worthwhile cause. However, there are ways to respect this and rough shotting over the organisation in this manner is not a dignified way to pay your respects!

RIP to those who have fallen and may you long be remembered and respected for all you gave to this great country!!
COYB

[drewks]

Armbands/poppies are NOT political.
FIFA are wrong - yet again.
Our FA's should, in my view, disregard their ruling, even if they threaten a points deduction. This is worth standing up for, and if we don't, I'll be very disappointed, to say the least.

I'm sure we've all got views on authority, and mine is normally to accept it and do what is said, but this is an exception; FIFA are nothing but a bunch of fools - they've proved this over the years and they continue to do so.

[Salopbaggie]

I think the argument F.I.F.A. will come back on that will be that because there was no symbol, just a date and it was for a friendly game as opposed to a qualifier, it was allowed.  I suspect the real reason is that no one at F.I.F.A. sussed it as a problem, as it was just a date.  Either way I think this emphasises the point I was making.  That once anyone is allowed to break the rule for whatever reason, it will be held up as precedent. I would suspect their are some people in the country who may find the celebration of the 1916 Uprising on a shirt a little offensive, even though they would probably not be able to tell you to much about it

---

Armbands/poppies are NOT political.
FIFA are wrong - yet again.
Our FA's should, in my view, disregard their ruling, even if they threaten a points deduction. This is worth standing up for, and if we don't, I'll be very disappointed, to say the least.

I'm sure we've all got views on authority, and mine is normally to accept it and do what is said, but this is an exception; FIFA are nothing but a bunch of fools - they've proved this over the years and they continue to do so.

I am just playing devils advocate here Drewks, I think the players should be allowed to wear them (if they wish), so go easy on me

If the poppy is a symbol by which we remember those who tragically lost their lives in conflicts/wars, can anyone suggest to me a conflict or war which was not about politics or religion?  If not, the natural progression to the argument is that there must be an association between politics or religion and the poppy.

[derbybaggie]

A healthy debate

Whilst I strongly support the poppy appeal I too can see F.I.F.A's view point. Good article from Independent raises a lot of valid points. http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/fifa...95321.html

[May68]

It amuses me that many of the people (not aiming this at anyone on here BTW) claiming poppies are not political, are the same people who froth at the mouth when James McLean takes the 'political' decision to not wear one. If wearing one is not political, then surely not wearing one is equally not political. You can't have it both ways.

[Devongone]

If you take an inclusivist view of politics very few images are a-political. The white poppy of peace is seen as political so I imagine the red one is too.

But why does China play in red, why does its badge refer to the Chinese flag? In that flag the red represents the communist revolution; the five stars and their relationship represent the unity of the Chinese people under the leadership of the Communist Party of China. A definite political statement!

Germany's shirts often have referred to German flag. The origins of that flag and those colours were in the 1848 unification of the country. Surely that's political? If you look around the shirts of the world you will see the politics of the world reflected back. The Republic of Ireland is about to be punished for its 1916 Easter uprising remembrance shirt! Political yes, but I don't think they were saying unite Ireland, bomb the UK mainland.

Political symbols are everywhere. All FIFA is proving is its own ignorance.

Barcelona display UNICEF on their shirt - so is the United Nations political and is the work of UNICEF totally a-political? Discuss.

[hibeejim21]

It amuses me that many of the people (not aiming this at anyone on here BTW) claiming poppies are not political, are the same people who froth at the mouth when James McLean takes the 'political' decision to not wear one. If wearing one is not political, then surely not wearing one is equally not political. You can't have it both ways.

A very good point.