[Dancingwilldoit]

Dev, I had you down for a rational sane man. Are you saying that now we have left the EU there will be no more money grabbing by stockbrokers and bankers? At least the EU had more chance of controlling their excesses than any UK government will. You say 48% of France want out, I assume that means the remaining 52% want stay, so what does that indicate?
Spain are very much I favour of staying in the EU as are Scotland and Northern Ireland maybe they can form an alliance with Gibraltar which also wanted to stay. Only Little England and our little old mentality want out

Maybe the EU is a corpse but at least its something that will float, something to hang on to - much better than Boris's belt. Where is he by the way? When the going gets tough he quickly disappears along with his Ultra Nationalist Ukip pal.

This really wasn't about us it was about our kids and their kids. We have well and truly shafted them. Do you honestly think they will turn round and say thank you in years to come?

When 11 year old kids are getting racist hate mail (because he is Polish) that could indicate just which way we are heading.
Do you honestly think that's a reason to be happy?

[bluepooch]

Did you say little Iceland and their old mentality ?

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Those Eagle sisters are frightening arent they !

[Dancingwilldoit]

Blue, Iceland deserved that fully, they were great. They did one very simple thing which they have done throughout the tournament - played to their own strengths. It might not be pretty but its bloody effective. I just wish we would do the same instead of trying to imitate a football team. I had them down to beat us last night and I think they will surprise France. I just love the Viking chant - would sound good in the Proact.

[bluepooch]

Their approach reminded me of Leicester las season .they will never win the all important possesion stats which seems to be an obsession with some but they are doing well in the only stat that counts.
Whats the point in stringing a 1000 passes from side to side while the opposition sits back and watches .
Im all for good passing football but there must be a purpose to it .

[Devongone]

Dancing - not one EU country or leader has come in and said don't go, we'd like you to stay or anything like it. They don't dislike the Scots, but they never really wanted the English in the EU and will be glad to carry our cases to the door. Their only worry is the effect our leaving might have. They'd like our money if only we could just stay home and out of their hair. They even want to tell us when to go even though Article 50 clearly puts the timing in our hands.

Spanish people under 30 have more chance of a job in Britain than their own country. Their fastest growing party is Podemos - anti the austerity imposed by the EU. The Spanish Government, not the people want the EU. As to Gibraltar it's just a hostage, its people have to want the EU, how else can such a colonial outpost of Britishness survive?

Italy is a financial basket case, only surviving in the euro on the conditional goodwill of the French and Germans. Portugal went ttips-up ages ago, Greece is a whipping boy, Belgium's gift-wrapping terrorists with its chocolates .......... France would ditch its leader tomorrow except it is scared his replacement would have a fascist father ........ Combined they've spent seven whole years trying unsuccessfully to negotiate a trade deal with a friendly United States, part of which would have meant the implementation of Ttip which would have led to American drug companies bankrupting our Health Service.

Of course the money men will still rule the world in or out of the EU, but wanting to be in a club that doesn't want or like you, because a rich elite is threatening to crash your currency just as it trashed the banks and the savings of thousands of innocent people a few years ago isn't close to the moral high ground. The referendum was called for political advantage by a posh boy who thought the voters were like the sheep on One Man and His Dog. I'm not in favour of referenda - there are lots of issues that if put to referenda would produce results we'd hate (there'd be capital punishment, maybe corporal, no gay rights, abortion might become next to impossible .....) But, if only by accident, the wisdom of crowds has to kick in sometime. This one the people got right, but I don't think most of them knew they'd have to have a kicking before they started to feel the benefits.

Voting Leave won't create a society or political system I want, or could support. Our idea of a coup is a few Labour MPs taking their ball in because no one is listening to them. We are small, creative, rather warlike little island bumbling into an unknown future. We'd have been that in or out of the EU, but this way we're doing our own bumbling.

Economists pretend their throwing of chicken bones equates to scientific study. It is a huge lie the media loves to digest and regurgitate for public consumption. It is not the science of insensible objects reacting upon one another to create an effect we can observe, which will create the same result every time. In Economics we, the people, are both cause and effect, more than that we are catalyst too. The result depends on what we choose to do and how we do it and the outcome may be different every single time.

We have gained a small freedom possibly totally to fcku up, or maybe even succeed. It is a very small thing. In the last few years we have made a major contribution to fkcuing up Iraq, Syria and Libya in the name of freedom, democracy, oil or whatever. We contributed to the immiseration of millions. Is the accusation of being a little englander hard to bear in this context? I'm not a little englander but I do want a very different country.

[Dancingwilldoit]

Dev,
Theres a lot wrong with the EU but becoming a right wing group of non white, non English haters isn't the way forward. We have been led up the garden path by a wealthy opportunist and a fascist moron. Whether you like it or not at least 80% of the leave vote was down to immigration. They were all whipped up into a frenzy by the delightful Mr Farage. If you think Boris and Nigel can lead us to the promised land then good luck.

[hibeejim21]

It's all very well hearing the disaffected banging on about a different country but you wont get it this route. Not at all.

There's no way the brexit is going to be anything other than EEA access and the four freedoms maintained including free movement of labour. It's the only way the City of London keeps it's passport and it's position of influence, and since the City of London runs the Tory party that's exactly what will happen. You might get a cut in net contributions and some other sop thrown in but it wont be worth it financially or politically.

What we're going to have over the next 3 months is a Tory squabble to decide which poor xxxx has to deliver this news to all the fuckwits that voted for it.

[bluepooch]

Im struggling to understand which party you support

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Dont you realise it is the disaffected who influenced this vote caused by 40 years of neglect from Tory and the Tory lite 'New labour' governments .

[St Charles Owl]

THe problem with this vote was that neither side could really give anything concrete or positive for anyone to hold onto or make an informed decision. The EU in its current state isn't working, look at unemployment across the mainland, the UK is doing better than virtually all on this one, look at the financial mess in Greece, or Spain, or Portugal or Italy, all of whom are of have been on the edge of a cliff with regards to defaulting and dropping pout of the EU.

The Leave campaign gave promises they cannot hope to keep and ultimately like everyone else have absolutely no idea what will happen now. It could go completely tits up or it could work, but we just don't know!! The Remain campaign were such EU skeptics at heart themselves (esp Corbyn) that they could offer virtually no solid reasons to stay, certainly none they could really substantiate!! This led to simple arguments over subject that in actual fact the EU or the UKs Membership of had little bearing on - immigration and the NHS!! We can already control our borders, you still need a passport to get into the UK as we are not part of Schengen anyway and we are an island, so everyone has to come through a port somewhere whether by boat, truck, car or plane!! We have economic migrant immigration because we choose to allow it, not because the EU demands it.

[hibeejim21]

Im struggling to understand which party you support

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Dont you realise it is the disaffected who influenced this vote caused by 40 years of neglect from Tory and the Tory lite 'New labour' governments .

Party politics have nothing to do with it. The disaffected have been totally duped,they think they are sticking it to the establishment when they are simply shooting themselves in the foot.

This was nothing more than a right wing coup in the tory party by stoking up hatred of immigrants. The huge rise in the stats of attacks on immigrants currently is just part of the pandoras box that's been opened.

Brexit won't solve our problems and it will make us poorer....in more ways than one.