[Baggie_One]

Let that be a lesson to sawyers on how to play football. Love him or hate him but grealish had him in his pocket the entire match. That was the worse I’ve seen us play so far. Liverpool next, god help us.

[BaggieSteve]

Let that be a lesson to sawyers on how to play football. Love him or hate him but grealish had him in his pocket the entire match. That was the worse I’ve seen us play so far. Liverpool next, god help us.

If ever we needed proof that this squad is not even close to premier league quality, this was it. We are an absolute embarrassment. I’m glad I live in Scotland with no Villa neighbours. I seriously think Derby’s record of lowest ever points could be beaten twice this year - by us and Sheffield United

[Blue Baggie]

Well I try not to post during the game, but 0 - 3 against the greasy seals is a joke.
I hope Sam dumps some of our gutless players. I still don't believe they don't have the ability.
For me, they have no desire to battle and other sides know it.
Sam may as well wield the axe, what's he got to lose.
Tonight Gibbs - Diangana - Sawyers should not be paid maybe that would make them try harder.

[Slick_Footwork]

Sorry to disagree Slick but Livermore’s tackle is a red. In the current climate, diving in and studs up will be a red card, even if you get the ball; the referee judges it as intent to foul. Whether any of us think this is fair really doesn’t matter. More importantly, all the players know this so why Livermore made that tackle is beyond me. He has cost us; we’re back in a Crystal Palace scenario, only against our biggest rivals. The guy is a complete dick!

Agree, as I stated in my post he was brainless. As soon as you jump in, you give the ref a decision to make. Even more stupid after being fouled, all he had to go was go down.

Still don't think it was a red though as there wasn't any contact or even close to any. I mean, a Villa fan at work saying it was the same as Lundsteom's earlier. I simply don't see it, Lundstrom went over the ball and then through the man. Livermore jumped yes, but hooked his foot around the ball. He didn't make any contact with Grealish at all, but Grealish goes rolling, shin pads out, like he's been shot.

[BaggieSteve]

Sorry to disagree Slick but Livermore’s tackle is a red. In the current climate, diving in and studs up will be a red card, even if you get the ball; the referee judges it as intent to foul. Whether any of us think this is fair really doesn’t matter. More importantly, all the players know this so why Livermore made that tackle is beyond me. He has cost us; we’re back in a Crystal Palace scenario, only against our biggest rivals. The guy is a complete dick!

Agree, as I stated in my post he was brainless. As soon as you jump in, you give the ref a decision to make. Even more stupid after being fouled, all he had to go was go down.

Still don't think it was a red though as there wasn't any contact or even close to any. I mean, a Villa fan at work saying it was the same as Lundsteom's earlier. I simply don't see it, Lundstrom went over the ball and then through the man. Livermore jumped yes, but hooked his foot around the ball. He didn't make any contact with Grealish at all, but Grealish goes rolling, shin pads out, like he's been shot.

There doesn’t have to be contact with the player; there have been plenty of examples in the last 2-3 seasons where a player has tackled, got the ball but has been seen by the referee as using excessive force and sent off as a result with the tackle being deemed as reckless. Livermore’s tackle ticked those boxes for the ref or rather VAR. A tackle like that years ago would have been applauded and no foul given but not now. Livermore knows that so why he launched himself at Grealish is beyond me. It was totally irresponsible. I think we would have lost anyway as the team was complete shite over the whole ninety minutes but you can’t escape the fact that Livermore, as skipper, was utterly stupid.

[Stairs]

I give up. I hear what you are all saying. It I am old school and in my book that was never a red card.

Grealish made the red happen with all the theatricals and if this continues he’s to be ignored we will soon have a game like a ballet.

I hope Sam can get some grit into the team as the next few games will kill our goal difference.

[Slick_Footwork]

Difficult game to analyse really, as we were down to 10 so early.

Personally didn't think Livermore's was a red. Yes, his foot was high but there was no contact and he simply hooked the ball. Felt Hause's deserved equal punishment.

Didn't think their pen was a foul by Ajayi.

We have lost to a better side, as much as I hate to say it, but I do think we were hard done to. I have no idea why we don't contest decisions like their pen, Hause's tackle or Mings kick of O'Shea. At least O'Shea went down for the latter and got Mings booked. As for their pen, if that was me I'd be all over Grealish calling him a diver. But Ajayi just walks away like a naughty schoolboy looking guilty. VAR probably do not look with any intention of reversing when you do that. Grealish on the other hand rolled around like he had been shot after his non-contact with Livermore and got him sent off.

I guess the 1 positive to take was that we didn't fold like against Palace. Especially considering Villa are a better side. It was pretty much a blueprint of a 10 men performance, keep it tight until the last 10 and then have a go. Unfortunately, we didn't have any quality when we did break out. The really frustrating one was the break that Phillips led, 2 on 2. He was running away from Luiz and you could see Luiz was going to put his arms on him, at which point Phillips could've gone down and given the ref a decision to make. Unfortunately rather than keep running Phillips decided to turn around and play backwards.

It's a tough task for Sam. We're poor at both ends but worst of all is our midfield. They are just so leggy that it's easy for teams to cut straight through us. The very first change Sam has to make is to move Ajayi into the centre of the park to protect the defence. We can bring any of the centre backs in. This would give us the added threat from set plays too. Which could be essential to us digging out some results.

---

Sorry to disagree Slick but Livermore’s tackle is a red. In the current climate, diving in and studs up will be a red card, even if you get the ball; the referee judges it as intent to foul. Whether any of us think this is fair really doesn’t matter. More importantly, all the players know this so why Livermore made that tackle is beyond me. He has cost us; we’re back in a Crystal Palace scenario, only against our biggest rivals. The guy is a complete dick!

Agree, as I stated in my post he was brainless. As soon as you jump in, you give the ref a decision to make. Even more stupid after being fouled, all he had to go was go down.

Still don't think it was a red though as there wasn't any contact or even close to any. I mean, a Villa fan at work saying it was the same as Lundsteom's earlier. I simply don't see it, Lundstrom went over the ball and then through the man. Livermore jumped yes, but hooked his foot around the ball. He didn't make any contact with Grealish at all, but Grealish goes rolling, shin pads out, like he's been shot.

There doesn’t have to be contact with the player; there have been plenty of examples in the last 2-3 seasons where a player has tackled, got the ball but has been seen by the referee as using excessive force and sent off as a result with the tackle being deemed as reckless. Livermore’s tackle ticked those boxes for the ref or rather VAR. A tackle like that years ago would have been applauded and no foul given but not now. Livermore knows that so why he launched himself at Grealish is beyond me. It was totally irresponsible. I think we would have lost anyway as the team was complete shite over the whole ninety minutes but you can’t escape the fact that Livermore, as skipper, was utterly stupid.

Livermore's actions were brainless as I stated in my first post.

We're a very ill disciplined side, which is quite ironic considering we barely put a tackle in. I mean even Sawyers was sent off in a game last season

But equally brainless is our lack of going down when we are fouled or trodden on, our failure to contest decisions against us, our failure to pressure the ref.

The reality is, Grealish went down under Livermore's tackle with the intention of getting him sent off and it worked. Grealish goes down in the box, under no contact, with the intention of getting a pen and it works. All Ajayi does is walks off like he's guilty. Our players need to wise up and fast. Big Sam needs to install some professionalism in the lads and quickly. At the moment, we are crap, weak and naive in equal proportions.

Luckily the window is not far away.

[Slick_Footwork]

Just saw the highlights for a 2nd viewing on BT's Youtube and feel even more hard done to.

The Hause tackle, the ref blows up when we are 2 on 1. So not only does he fail to send him off when he tackled Diangana above the ankle, he also stops one of our few chances with 10.

Pen is a stonewall dive. Grealish fell over. Not even a good dive by his standards. How VAR can not overrule that is beyond me.

[Baggiebob(BBB)]

Seems we like playing with 10 men.

[Salopbaggie]

So in analysis this is the same team SB put out against Manchester City (for which his team selection was criticised), it was even the same three players substituted, who would believe it? Only thing different was the manager and we were away for the City game. So what is the reason? Players throwing a strop? Villa are a better team than Man City? Bilic is better manager than Allardyce? Grealish, Watkins and El Ghazi might be good, but would you prefer them in your team to, De Bruyne, Sterling and Jesus? If this team is capable of drawing away from home with a team like Man City, and this was how they played the following week, the only thing to say is: ALLARDYCE OUT