(28-08-2019, 13:51)BaggieSteve Wrote: Like every poster so far, I feel both extremely sad for the Bury fans and angry that, by the look of it, the wider footballing hierarchy doesn't give a sh*t about their club. As in all these things, it's the genuine lifelong supporters who lose out (let's face it, if you support Bury you're unlikely to be a glory hunter), people who have been going for years, through thick and thin (but mainly thin) and for whom the town has lost something genuinely important to their identity and sense of community.

As someone who spent a career working in the private sector, I appreciate the principles of the free market and that unsustainable and uncompetitive companies go to the wall, with all the social fallout that entails; but football clubs are not like listed FTSE companies, the position they assume in a social context is different to companies, even though the latter are providers of essential employment. I also hear the argument that football should be run on better business lines which would include allowing clubs to fail - and I'd agree there is vaidity in this - but, if that is the case, then a number of high profile, premier league clubs should have gone to the wall years ago, with the level of debt they are carrying. The advantage for them is that Sky money or acquisition by a sovereign wealth fund has completely distorted the business model of P&L, and allows them to just about service the debts they accumulate. Bury have no such luxury.

For me, an unpalatable feeling is that football has lost much of its soul; the only clubs that seem to matter are those who appear on MOTD and who populate the websites and back pages with filler stories of little importance. The increasing availability of televised football has allowed a football "fan" in Torquay, or elsewhere similar, or to declare his undying love for Man United/Man City/Liverpool (delete as appropriate), buy the replica shirt, watch his team from the comfort of his/her sofa and never venture near an actual football ground, least of all the one occupied by his local, small town club which just happens to play several leagues below the EPL and so gets no publicity, except when it folds.

I just wish that the footballing community - by which I suppose I mean those administrators in the higher reaches of the Football League and FA - would care about those small clubs desperately trying to survive from hand to mouth, rather than enjoying the trappings of wealth that come from the obscene amounts of money associated with the EPL.

I apologise if I sound like a grumpy old git who yearns for the days of "jumpers for goalposts" as I'm not really like that (others may disagree) but I feel really strongly that this is just another example of "I'm alright Jack, so f*ck you".

(28-08-2019, 15:12)Northwalesbaggie Wrote:

(28-08-2019, 13:51)BaggieSteve Wrote: Like every poster so far, I feel both extremely sad for the Bury fans and angry that, by the look of it, the wider footballing hierarchy doesn't give a sh*t about their club. As in all these things, it's the genuine lifelong supporters who lose out (let's face it, if you support Bury you're unlikely to be a glory hunter), people who have been going for years, through thick and thin (but mainly thin) and for whom the town has lost something genuinely important to their identity and sense of community.

As someone who spent a career working in the private sector, I appreciate the principles of the free market and that unsustainable and uncompetitive companies go to the wall, with all the social fallout that entails; but football clubs are not like listed FTSE companies, the position they assume in a social context is different to companies, even though the latter are providers of essential employment. I also hear the argument that football should be run on better business lines which would include allowing clubs to fail - and I'd agree there is vaidity in this - but, if that is the case, then a number of high profile, premier league clubs should have gone to the wall years ago, with the level of debt they are carrying. The advantage for them is that Sky money or acquisition by a sovereign wealth fund has completely distorted the business model of P&L, and allows them to just about service the debts they accumulate. Bury have no such luxury.

For me, an unpalatable feeling is that football has lost much of its soul; the only clubs that seem to matter are those who appear on MOTD and who populate the websites and back pages with filler stories of little importance. The increasing availability of televised football has allowed a football "fan" in Torquay, or elsewhere similar, or to declare his undying love for Man United/Man City/Liverpool (delete as appropriate), buy the replica shirt, watch his team from the comfort of his/her sofa and never venture near an actual football ground, least of all the one occupied by his local, small town club which just happens to play several leagues below the EPL and so gets no publicity, except when it folds.

I just wish that the footballing community - by which I suppose I mean those administrators in the higher reaches of the Football League and FA - would care about those small clubs desperately trying to survive from hand to mouth, rather than enjoying the trappings of wealth that come from the obscene amounts of money associated with the EPL.

I apologise if I sound like a grumpy old git who yearns for the days of "jumpers for goalposts" as I'm not really like that (others may disagree) but I feel really strongly that this is just another example of "I'm alright Jack, so f*ck you".

Spot on Steve. The soul went out of football when the PL was formed. Much as i liked watching the Baggies play in the PL, it's far more enjoyable for me in the EFL where there is still a bit of Soul left. Others may disagree.

(28-08-2019, 15:26)themaclad Wrote: The irony of Gary Neville saying the club should be saved when he and his mates have ploughed their cash into a club with no tradition whatsover in a vanity project. As for Bury crying shame and a large responsibility lies with those pillocks at the EFL

(28-08-2019, 16:39)BaggieSteve Wrote:

(28-08-2019, 15:12)Northwalesbaggie Wrote:

(28-08-2019, 13:51)BaggieSteve Wrote: Like every poster so far, I feel both extremely sad for the Bury fans and angry that, by the look of it, the wider footballing hierarchy doesn't give a sh*t about their club. As in all these things, it's the genuine lifelong supporters who lose out (let's face it, if you support Bury you're unlikely to be a glory hunter), people who have been going for years, through thick and thin (but mainly thin) and for whom the town has lost something genuinely important to their identity and sense of community.

As someone who spent a career working in the private sector, I appreciate the principles of the free market and that unsustainable and uncompetitive companies go to the wall, with all the social fallout that entails; but football clubs are not like listed FTSE companies, the position they assume in a social context is different to companies, even though the latter are providers of essential employment. I also hear the argument that football should be run on better business lines which would include allowing clubs to fail - and I'd agree there is vaidity in this - but, if that is the case, then a number of high profile, premier league clubs should have gone to the wall years ago, with the level of debt they are carrying. The advantage for them is that Sky money or acquisition by a sovereign wealth fund has completely distorted the business model of P&L, and allows them to just about service the debts they accumulate. Bury have no such luxury.

For me, an unpalatable feeling is that football has lost much of its soul; the only clubs that seem to matter are those who appear on MOTD and who populate the websites and back pages with filler stories of little importance. The increasing availability of televised football has allowed a football "fan" in Torquay, or elsewhere similar, or to declare his undying love for Man United/Man City/Liverpool (delete as appropriate), buy the replica shirt, watch his team from the comfort of his/her sofa and never venture near an actual football ground, least of all the one occupied by his local, small town club which just happens to play several leagues below the EPL and so gets no publicity, except when it folds.

I just wish that the footballing community - by which I suppose I mean those administrators in the higher reaches of the Football League and FA - would care about those small clubs desperately trying to survive from hand to mouth, rather than enjoying the trappings of wealth that come from the obscene amounts of money associated with the EPL.

I apologise if I sound like a grumpy old git who yearns for the days of "jumpers for goalposts" as I'm not really like that (others may disagree) but I feel really strongly that this is just another example of "I'm alright Jack, so f*ck you".

Spot on Steve. The soul went out of football when the PL was formed. Much as i liked watching the Baggies play in the PL, it's far more enjoyable for me in the EFL where there is still a bit of Soul left. Others may disagree.

Northwales, totally agree! I'd be happy to compete for the Championship, achieve promotion and then turn it down, strange as that sounds. I have never really enjoyed our stays in the EPL, I've always felt our role there was to allow "bigger" teams to fulfill a fixture list

(28-08-2019, 20:29)themaclad Wrote: The interest on Bury’s loan per year since 2014 was 138%