[TheWorthinGer]

dinnae think I've actually said anywhere that ibrox is the real source of sectarianism,although I do think its a source. and I never said you obtain sectarianism and bigotry, I said a feeling of hatred and bigotry is something you obtain.

You should reread your own posts.

"source-a thing, person or place from which something originates or can be obtained. unquote."

And [re]read the post of your foolish compatriot that you attempted to support.

[hibeejim21]

It undeniably is paignton. The fans are by 'tradition' anti Celtic , anti Catholic, Anti Republic of Ireland, and many of them take part in the annual Orange parades in Glasgow and Ulster.

The club itself recognise this and their 'tradition' and turn a blind eye to, and when its OK, encourage the very worst of sectarian and bigoted behaviour from these fans. It goes all the way back from flute bands being played over the tannoy at Ibrox, the stadium being used as a venue by the Orange Lodge , orange strips,a sectarian signing policy,the £1690 season ticket ....Need I go on? The place has always been a vehicle for a certain kind of  'expression'

Murray was not blameless , he knew the score and has always recognised the potential short term damage to the clubs revenue if he distanced himself too far from the 'grass roots'. But when UEFA came calling he and bain at least tried to take things forward.

Now they have been caught out singing a proscribed ,discriminatory song,and its the usual lash out at everyone else who calls them out for it.The default position is always deny that they have ever done anything wrong and that they were simply victimised by people who just don't like them. They admit it themselves,you must never,ever pull rangers up alone for the problem - its always other clubs too.

And because of that and the cowardice of our media/authorities it will always remain in place.Its a disgrace and hibs fans are right to be angry about being dragged into their tawdry little prejudices as some kind of proxy for celtic.

And thats it -im saying nothing more on the subject.

[Paigntonhibby]

dinnae think I've actually said anywhere that ibrox is the real source of sectarianism,although I do think its a source. and I never said you obtain sectarianism and bigotry, I said a feeling of hatred and bigotry is something you obtain.

You should reread your own posts.

"source-a thing, person or place from which something originates OR CAN BE OBTAINED. unquote."

---

that disnae sound at all like "ibrox is the real source of sectarianism. unfortunately as long as there are denyists,apologists and whitabootists like yersel worth, the cancer that is bigotry in our game will never be tackled or cured. and like my compatriot H.J who is also probably fed up talking tae the deaf and blind i'm finished wi' this subject GGTTH

[TheWorthinGer]

dinnae think I've actually said anywhere that ibrox is the real source of sectarianism,although I do think its a source. and I never said you obtain sectarianism and bigotry, I said a feeling of hatred and bigotry is something you obtain.

You should reread your own posts.

"source-a thing, person or place from which something originates OR CAN BE OBTAINED. unquote."

---

that disnae sound at all like "ibrox is the real source of sectarianism. unfortunately as long as there are denyists,apologists and whitabootists like yersel worth, the cancer that is bigotry in our game will never be tackled or cured. and like my compatriot H.J who is also probably fed up talking tae the deaf and blind i'm finished wi' this subject GGTTH

I think you'll find that I have denied nothing, defended nothing and most certainly apologised for nothing. Denial would imply there is something I want to hide; defend would imply that I have done something questionable; and apology would be to suggest that I have done wrong.  None of which are true in this case.  I have merely challenged the obvious and irresolvable stupidity of the statements made by you and your ilk.

As long as dumbfuqs like you and your mate above are good for nothing but throwing accusations about you will be treated with the contempt you deserve.  The pointing finger adds nothing to any solution.

[0762]

Looking through the posts on this topic, it must be plainly obvious to any moderator and other observers/readers that we're observing effectively a bad person/fan who is trying to apply certain arguments/defences of normal decent posters/people. We know who this individual is and the use of vicious insinuations, accusations, innuendo, denial and all kinda little devious techniques to deflect away from a fairly damning current position/operation at Ibrox is absolutely breathtaking TBF. The lack of any contrition re this observed sectarian position is breathtaking and the antagonism and expletives clearly expose his leaning towards a practise that is deemed a hate crime in this country. Suggestion: Don't even communicate or respond to this kinda scum because there is no point. REMOVE HIS AUDIENCE AND IGNORING HIM IS THE MOST EFFECTIVE ACTION THAT YOU COULD EVER APPLY!! SIMILARLY MARGINALISE SECTARIANISM AND EFFECTIVELY ISOLATE THESE PEOPLE FROM THEIR MAIN FUNCTION , A HATE FUNCTION/ HATE CRIME AND EXPOSE THEM/REPORT THEM AT EVERY OPPORTUNITY IF THEY WANNA ATTEMPT TO PEDDLE THIS KINDA POISONOUS HATEFUL BILE ANYWHERE!!
Also my concluding comment to supercooper is effectively an apology - I was a tad extreme in my response to some of your comments but quite honestly I'm generally in an unforgiving mood when it comes to observed sectarianism, racism or homophobia for that matter. At least you acknowledged there is a problem and as a ST holder, you must witness it as well as certain hushed media that should be challenging the practise a lot more than they do. Sectarianism remains with scum fit for the gutter and that's a fact! Also a concerted move to sanitise Ibrox with Rangers full cooperation may not eradicate nsectatrianism but it would certainly send a strong message that one bastion of sectarianism has finally been blighted and we move on to the other smaller realms of this insidious practise elsewhere in our country - WHERE THERE'S A WILL, THERE'S A WAY TO ERADICATE IT AND THERE ARE LOTSA EFFECTIVE MODERN TECHNIQUES TO APPLY WHEN SERIOUSLY DEALING WITH IT!!

[supercooper]

100% correct Trus!!!  The premise of the question in the OP is completely wrong!!  To use a current affairs analogy from over here, this is the same as Donald Trump's solution to Islamist extremists, simply ban Muslims to remove the problem!!

If you want to discuss sectarianism in Scottish football and indeed in Scottish society then do so, but to simply "ban" one offender while ignoring the bigger picture is either just petty hatred towards Rangers or even worse complete ignorance of the problem as a whole.  There are very few mainsteam clubs in Scotland who have not suffered from an element of their support spouting sectarian crap, Hibs included, its time that Scottish Football and more importantly the Scottish legal system deals with this across the board.

I think some clubs have done a lot to eradicate this and for sure Rangers need to do a lot more to stop this at Ibrox but continually blaming just one portion of the problem will not eradicate this as a whole.

St Charles Owl, note for info officials of Hibs FC dealt with this problem well over 30 years ago when it was identified and a rigidly implemented non-sectarian policy was hugely successful! Supporters were consulted together with bus conveners and other supporter club officials throughout the Hibs fan base. Any remnant of sectarianism is absolutely miniscule, one remnant being the Hibs casuals fraternity (banned by Hibs FC years ago!) who I'd argue deliberately target certain football fans by baiting them with sectarian taunts for the sole purpose of drawing them in and battering them senseless - many Old Firm fans (and others, incl targeted English and Euro fans) have been victims/casualties of this violent fraternity, many of whom are trained in martial arts and boxing etc and they move in organised swarms to protect themselves and severely hurt their victims in the process. That's why their members have been banned for decades by Hibs and that ban continues per se. Hibernian FC is a community football club and a damn good progressive one that is run in the proper way. Compare this transformation with the likes of Rangers FC and there's no comparison. As another poster has alluded - Rangers have tried to change things for the better but they have not done enough! Also I wish some of the defensive comments would stop insinuating hatred of the football club - the truth of the matter is thousands of decent football fans despise the outlandish practise of promoting sectarianism together with the intimidation, the threats, the documented violence attached to it and many other acts of antagonism. How anyone can actually deny these insinuations as being groundless is beyond me. I acknowledge there are similar issues elsewhere in Scottish society and in Scottish football. However, like many other critical football fans, I regard RFC is one of the 'big fish' offenders that should've been reeled in years ago for the good of the club itself and ultimately for the good of the game - that would've been a huge breath of fresh air if this action had even been half successful and they'd managed to weed out a significant proportion of anarchists/offenders who just shouldn't be there. A formally drafted anti-sectarian mission statement would be a start with signs erected throughout their stadium to endorse such a policy but that kinda action would just be the start of a concerted effort to 'clean up their act' big time. 

There are statements made every home game over the tannoy about not singing sectarian songs. Had you listened throughout the whole time you visited our ground you would have heard. The police should have been doing their jobs if they spotted sectarian chanting, Rangers as a club have been congratulated for their stance on bigotry, and their attempts to eradicate it. The only club that still pander to fans are the other mob from the East end.

[hibeejim21]

Sounds like its not us that need to hear the announcement,its the home support !
It was pretty obvious from BTs cameras what certain fans were singing, rangers know who these fans are and where they sit and easily could issue bans much like dare i say it hearts have recently.

Palming things off solely on the police is just daft and the easy way out,they can't arrest tens of thousands of people.

Nae luck on your prediction for our game btw.

[0762]

100% correct Trus!!!  The premise of the question in the OP is completely wrong!!  To use a current affairs analogy from over here, this is the same as Donald Trump's solution to Islamist extremists, simply ban Muslims to remove the problem!!

If you want to discuss sectarianism in Scottish football and indeed in Scottish society then do so, but to simply "ban" one offender while ignoring the bigger picture is either just petty hatred towards Rangers or even worse complete ignorance of the problem as a whole.  There are very few mainsteam clubs in Scotland who have not suffered from an element of their support spouting sectarian crap, Hibs included, its time that Scottish Football and more importantly the Scottish legal system deals with this across the board.

I think some clubs have done a lot to eradicate this and for sure Rangers need to do a lot more to stop this at Ibrox but continually blaming just one portion of the problem will not eradicate this as a whole.

St Charles Owl, note for info officials of Hibs FC dealt with this problem well over 30 years ago when it was identified and a rigidly implemented non-sectarian policy was hugely successful! Supporters were consulted together with bus conveners and other supporter club officials throughout the Hibs fan base. Any remnant of sectarianism is absolutely miniscule, one remnant being the Hibs casuals fraternity (banned by Hibs FC years ago!) who I'd argue deliberately target certain football fans by baiting them with sectarian taunts for the sole purpose of drawing them in and battering them senseless - many Old Firm fans (and others, incl targeted English and Euro fans) have been victims/casualties of this violent fraternity, many of whom are trained in martial arts and boxing etc and they move in organised swarms to protect themselves and severely hurt their victims in the process. That's why their members have been banned for decades by Hibs and that ban continues per se. Hibernian FC is a community football club and a damn good progressive one that is run in the proper way. Compare this transformation with the likes of Rangers FC and there's no comparison. As another poster has alluded - Rangers have tried to change things for the better but they have not done enough! Also I wish some of the defensive comments would stop insinuating hatred of the football club - the truth of the matter is thousands of decent football fans despise the outlandish practise of promoting sectarianism together with the intimidation, the threats, the documented violence attached to it and many other acts of antagonism. How anyone can actually deny these insinuations as being groundless is beyond me. I acknowledge there are similar issues elsewhere in Scottish society and in Scottish football. However, like many other critical football fans, I regard RFC is one of the 'big fish' offenders that should've been reeled in years ago for the good of the club itself and ultimately for the good of the game - that would've been a huge breath of fresh air if this action had even been half successful and they'd managed to weed out a significant proportion of anarchists/offenders who just shouldn't be there. A formally drafted anti-sectarian mission statement would be a start with signs erected throughout their stadium to endorse such a policy but that kinda action would just be the start of a concerted effort to 'clean up their act' big time. 

There are statements made every home game over the tannoy about not singing sectarian songs. Had you listened throughout the whole time you visited our ground you would have heard. The police should have been doing their jobs if they spotted sectarian chanting, Rangers as a club have been congratulated for their stance on bigotry, and their attempts to eradicate it. The only club that still pander to fans are the other mob from the East end.

The message was prob drowned out by all the noisy chanting SuperCooper   but it's good to know that this kinda message is in place. The difficulty appears to be wanton disobedience, which is a shame and it compromises the club and the Police.

[supercooper]

Nae luck on your prediction for our game btw.

Nae bother i'm happy that we extended the goal difference by another Five Goals 

[HerefordBull]

Aye Coop, if it comes down to goal difference there is only going to be one winner........its all about points now.